Official Statement from Take Back NYU!
Feb 21st, 2009 by Take Back NYU!
Take Back the Balcony!, Thursday night, Bob Burdalski
From 10 pm on February 18th 2009 to 2 pm on February 20th, students of Take Back NYU! occupied the Kimmel Center for University Life in a historic effort to bring pressure on NYU for its administrative and ethical failings regarding transparency, democracy and protection of human rights.
During the occupation students rallied hundreds of supporters to the streets of New York, drew national and international press coverage, and sparked a long-needed discussion about the NYU community. For these reasons and more, Take Back NYU! believes the occupation represents a historic moment, and by many measures a success.
However, we also recognize that our occupation was not a full success. When we succeeded, we did so because the passion of our movement shone through the smoke and mirrors cast by the NYU administration. When we failed it was only because we underestimated the lengths NYU will go to in order to deter any real criticism of its policies.
The administration demonstrated their steadfast commitment to ignoring its students. Members of Take Back NYU! didn’t even see the face of NYU negotiator Lynne Brown until 26 hours into the occupation. Throughout, the administration only gave disingenuous offers of discussion without negotiation, which the students readily rejected. NYU’s refusal to negotiate contrasts sharply with good-faith negotiations made by other universities during similar occupations.
We believe that our occupation gave NYU the opportunity to become a leader among universities and to build our community around strong commitments to democracy, transparency and respect for human rights. Instead, NYU said ‘pass’ and chose to stick to its narrow interests at the expense of genuine discussion.
In the course of defending its secrets, NYU put students and its security guards at risk by encouraging the use of physical force to end a non-violent protest. NYPD officers used billy-clubs and mace against demonstrators outside the building. These acts of aggression have gone unmentioned and unquestioned in the course of NYU’s handling of the occupation.
This protest is just a beginning to what is to come. The action made national and international news, and showcased the real power of the new student movement sweeping the globe. Here in New York, a City Council member, Charles Barron, has publicly endorsed our campaign and shamed the University for its mishandling of student protest. Actions at universities around the city will continue in the weeks to come.
No doubt NYU will begin attempting disciplinary action, but no suspensions, expulsions or arrests can contain what began in the last two days. This fight will carry on in the hands of the dozens of people who made it inside, and the hundreds more who came out to support the occupation. NYU showed its irrational need to defend secrecy and its exclusive hold on power, and that alone will drive this movement forward.
In the immediate future, we hope to have the opportunity to discuss the core issues of the occupation with the NYU community, including the administration. Take Back NYU! remains willing to open negotiations about these issues, should NYU decided to come forth in good-faith. In the mean time, we encourage supporters to contact administrators to ask that NYU end suspensions, drop threats of expulsion and that students be allowed to remain in their residences on campus. The willingness to express and act on dissent should not result in the disruption of students’ education or housing.
For everyone showing support: the real lesson here is that you can act and you can make a difference. Take the lessons from the occupation on to your own struggle, and begin to act yourself.
Onward.
So much love to you all. I think this occupation and the university’s response has proved just why TBNYU! is so needed on our campus, and I’m honored to call you all my classmates, fellow organizers, and friends.
Recuperate and rest. Then keep fighting the good fight!
You can’t call this a historic event a day after it happened. Just adds more credence to the fact the a large number of people believe TBNYU did this for the glory and to attempt to be revolutionaries by “sticking it to the man” rather than actually attempting to incite necessary change.
Yes! Fight for the rights of the kids going to the $50,000 school in the middle of the most expensive city in America! I, for one, am sitting in my $2,000 a month apartment feeling absolutely ecstatic that people are fighting against my oppressors.
People, really, if you want to make a change in this world, find the people who actually need help. Otherwise nobody’s going to take you seriously.
“In the course of defending its secrets, NYU put students and its security guards at risk by encouraging the use of physical force to end a non-violent protest.”
Quite powerfully articulated!
Just wanted to express my support. People all around Europe are waking up as well, and we have to fight for our rights.
Cheers
Pavel, UK/Bulgaria
youtube.com/watch?v=LGGys03mpyk
Check it out to see police battoning
Support from those who recognise that America was founded on political protest, that such protest is necessary to any democracy worthy of the name.
Solidarity from the UK.
I think you guys underestimate what a success the occupation was. I know you didn’t win your demands, but the amount of media attention that was focused on NYU was massive and amazing. The whole world heard about what happened at NYU. You couldn’t buy that type of media attention. The most important thing was that you made it clear that you were willing to resist.
“If there is no struggle there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom and yet deprecate agitation are men who want crops without plowing up the ground; they want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters.”- Frederick Douglass
The level of ignorance and anger indicated in some of the comments here is really disturbing. These students spent years trying to go through the “legitimate” channels of NYU bureaucracy and were barred every time. The argument of “It’s a private institution so don’t come.” holds no more water than “If you disagree with the president leave America”. Most of those involved in the protest love and take an active part in their NYU education, and many are paying their own way through. To dismiss them as “spoiled brats” or an of a number of empty-minded insults I have seen is for lack of a better word, super lame.
NYU is a private university, and as such they can do or admit whomever or whatever they please. You folks knew that when you went to the school, as my daughter did when she went. You also knew how much it cost. Hard to have sympathy for your “cause”, when you are all acting like a bunch of babies. There are plenty of other fine schools, less expensive, for you to go to if you cannot afford NYU, and I agree the school is quite expensive. As for the scholarships for Gaza students, how about some for students from Africa or other impoverished nations? How about some for the children of Israelis killed by Arab terrorists? You’ll have to create ALOT of scholarships to go around.
This isn’t the sixties you got going. You knew what you were getting into. I wish you all well, but you haven’t got a case at NYU.
Going to NYU is a privilege, not a right. You folks are throwing away a chance many others would die for. You are well intentioned, but choose your battles wisely. You will not win this one. Stay at NYU, take advantage of this great privilege, and be around. to fight your fights another day. You cannot take back what was not yours to begin with. NYU is private, you KNEW this, as well as the cost. Please think of what you are throwing away!!
I respect your intentions to bring about transparency. And I hope your team gets a chance to rebuild the Palestinian university.
Wow Jane, World Peace is “so last year”? I wonder what else is on your “so last year” list…a cure for cancer? Talk about self-indulgent…. And guess what? I know that at least one of these students IS “doing anything for an NYU education” because she is my daughter. She gets hardly any monetary support from us because we simply cannot afford it, but we told her along as she was growing up that if she focused on her studies and gave her pre-college education the very best she had, that scholarships would surely follow that would enable her to go to college. When she was offered an honors scholarship at NYU she did the research and got the loans and outside work (her day begins at 7am for work, ends most days around 7pm after classes, then she gets to study and do laundry,etc. til around midnight - that leaves very little time for “self indulgence”) - so that she could attend the college that seemed to her to be the best choice to be a good foundation for her future. So you see Jane, you are making a pretty sweeping statement concerning people you clearly do not know. Even though my daughter is busy being responsible for her own education (dean’s list last semester) she is not too busy to be involved and passionate when she sees something that she thinks should be fixed. Finally, this action was far from advocating the cause of “hating NYU”. The students have been trying for 2 years to get someone from NYU’s administration to meet with them and address their concerns. After 2 years it became clear that asking politely was not getting them anywhere. So Jane, I am sorry that the TBNYU! cause is not one that you sympathize with but please do not criticize what you don’t know.
As a long time activist, I respect people who stand up for turning wrong into right. I asked many of my friends if they got your point and none did. You request transparency from a private school, why? what right do you have to audit this organization? You are asking 13 scholarships a year for students from Gaza, why? why not 14? why not students from Kazakhstan? Maybe I miss something, but it seems that this is your personal agenda, which you have the right to advocate, but no right to demand it and to endanger people with wild demonstration. Unfortunately, it seems that you are about to learn the lesson the hard way.
” ‘In the course of defending its secrets, NYU put students and its security guards at risk by encouraging the use of physical force to end a non-violent protest.’
Quite powerfully articulated!”
And quite the complete fucking untruth. Bum rushing a line of security guards in an effort to trespass and break into NYU’s building is not a non-violent action by any stretch of the imagination. For a bunch of children who clearly idolize the radicals of the 1960s, you’ve demonstrated an incredible ignorance of what they did and how they did it.
Kyoto:
http://extasy07.exblog.jp/
This was a great public art piece — it’s wonderful to see students breaking routine and tearing down alienation through social action.
But as a political action, the occupation fails so utterly it’s hard to imagine what if any forethought went into it.
The list of demands is an incoherent hash, an internally conflicted wish-list hamstrung by the attitude of entitlement that surrounds it.
I can’t help echoing Alexandra’s comments from another thread:
“You have all these resources at your fingertips and enthusiasm to change things and you barricade yourselves in a cafeteria? There is REAL oppression in the world and the private organization you applied for not opening their books for you isn’t it.”
Furthermore, including the Gaza question in the protests only serves to make your other demands look frivolous in the extreme. If you’re really that interested in making NYU open its books, get a degree in Higher Ed Administration, understand the fundamentals of the University’s position, then get hired to change it. Occupying Kimmel and patting yourselves on the back for fighting to unveil NYU’s “secrets,” as articulated in this blog’s weirdly cultish language, is a futile gesture.
Good work, keep up the good fight, dont let the bastards get you down.
Solidarity from the UK.
i support you all 110%. i hope you can turn what many see as an overzealous act into a sustained movement. the things you are protesting against have been protested for years. NYU admin has a rich history of quashing dissent, and destroying employee (particularly TAs) efforts to unionize, going back at least to 2005.
Here’s my suggestion. Contact the AFL-CIO, whose president, John Sweeney, was arrested at a protest at NYU in 2005. Contact the United Auto-Workers, who were also present at that protest. Organize the TAs to appeal to the National Labor Relations Board, which, under Obama, may be more receptive than under Bush. These are all boring efforts compared to an occupation. But exhaust all means, never allow yourself to pass up a tactic because it seems difficult or unpopular.
We support you. Give us something living and breathing, and we will make it last. Turn this seemingly isolated act of protest into a full-on movement. And a small bit of advice–though I personally support the idea, the stuff about Gaza & Palestinian students may have been a tactical error. With the economic crisis and the corporate scandals of recent months, you had everyone’s ears on NYU transparency, and even on the right to unionize. But many, many people were turned off by the Gaza and Palestine stuff. Keep it coherent.
SOLIDARITY!!!!!!!!!
I wanted to get out into the rally when I first saw it, but of course I had to check up on what you all were demanding. This organization would have so much more support if your demands were well organized. You could have at least 16,000 kids out there if your list just had #3-8. You aren’t quite in touch with what we want. I would have supported you, but now I just find you quite childish.
It pains me to to say it, but you all really embarrassed yourselves. The dancing on the balcony just illustrated that you really don’t understand what it means to protest anything in an organized, serious way. I was impressed with your initiative when I heard that a group of students at NYU finally did something gutsy. But taking over a cafeteria is not taking over a building, nor does it disrupt anything but the distribution of food, which happens at plenty of other places on a campus. Stop being so self-congratulatory. The only thing you achieved was publicity for yourselves. Was that the intention? If so, then you did a lovely job. If it was really to bring attention to something serious and to potentially create a space for dialogue and change, then you failed. Miserably.
>Jane
Um they got into NYU through their own hard work not through some sort of entitlement and if you ever went to NYU you would know how extremely expensive it can be for those hard working students who weren’t born into families of wealth, regardless of that people have a right to know what is going on when it comes to where their money is going and have a right to have their voices heard - the right to free speech and all that, ever hear of it hmmm maybe you need more study & less time playing on the web; obviously you speak from ignorance and should be afforded no more attention so Ill just close by saying good show TBNYU! To those who speak up against an unfair system that has been in place for a long time. Thanks for taking a stand!
Have you nothing to say on what this university has done to Washington Sq. Park and those that wish to keep their homes! That is the real issue.
“When we failed it was only because we underestimated the lengths NYU will go to in order to deter any real criticism of its policies.”
incorrect. NYU’s commitment to opacity had something to do with the action’s failure, but it was far from the ONLY factor. TBNYU’s lack of focus and juvenile public image also played a significant part in the negative outcome. there was no pressure on the administration to treat TBNYU like a legitimate political force because TBNYU had very little support from the general NYU community.
wake up, regroup, and learn from your mistakes. try again, but for god’s sake be smarter about it next time.
First of all it’s AN historic.
As a graduate of NYU and someone with lots of student loans, this whole stunt really pisses me off.
firstly, i still support you 100%. as someone who was involved with a divestment campaign at my university (both for coke and for israeli divestment) i understand the logic behind your arguments intimately.
the first thing i would say to those who are claiming the demands are an “incoherent” list, remember this: TBNYU! is a *coalition* of a bunch of student orgs, from amnesty int. to the free palestine group. one thing most of these groups have in common are human rights; apart from that TBNYU is demanding transparency which is a pretty reasonable demand. if you invest your money in a mutual fund (a private institution as much as NYU) you still have the ability to see where the money is and what it is doing. with an academic institution like NYU, it becomes even more important because human lives are very much invested in their educations there (and money) so if we’re talking about fairness, transparency should be even more easily attainable than a private investment fund.
the purpose of an occupation, first and foremost, is as a high-profile *demonstration*. the students demonstrated; no property was damaged, there was no intended violence on behalf of the occupiers against anyone (which cannot be said of the police or security, i think). what, then, is ethically wrong with the occupation, or why is it worthy of such rabid criticism?
i think it’s important to understand that the logic of an occupation is first, as a demonstration; secondly, it’s part of a worldwide motion of solidarity with students in greece, the UK, the New School, and elsewhere. all of these groups have been making similar demands, and all of it is in solidarity with one another, including students in gaza. the really incredible thing about all of this is that it is a growing movement; a burgeoning of student radicalism. i know students in ohio, california, virginia, texas, and elsewhere who are discussing similar tactics, and similar demands from their administrations both public and private. with the reestablishment of the SDS, i think we are on the cusp of something big and substantial. you don’t need a weatherman to tell which way the wind blows.
lastly, the reason TBNYU! asked for 13 scholarships for Palestinian students is because there are currently 13 Palestinian students at NYU. TBNYU was asking for free tuition for these students; i’m sure the number would adjust as enrollment requires. makes perfect sense to me.
I love you, NYUMom! you’ve obviously raised your daughter well. i only hope i can do as well with my son. hats off to everyone involved — the occupation has given me hope for the generations ahead of me and for my son’s by extension.
I applaud the passion of the protesters. It is important for young leaders to fight for social justice and transperency.
That said, this particular protest bordered on the comical. Spoiled private university students barricading the luxurious student union at their expensive university in the West Village in order to achieve a confusing and wide reaching set of demands that included among other disparate things, budget transperency and scholaships for Gazans.
If you are concerned about the former the transfer to another school. NYU is a private organization and such demands can be brought up through normal processes such as letters to the tustees or to their auditors.
If the students want scholarships for the oppresed, then they can attempt legal fundraisers for Kurds, Copts, indegenous people of South America, Darfurians, etc. The focus on Gaza shows a narrow understanding of the true injustice around the globe and instead the typical shallow concern for cause celeb of the Palestinian people (who are largely responsible for the failure of myriad peace processes over the decades).
you know what the saddest thing about this whole “occupation” is?? now that it’s all said and done with, the protestors have actually resorted to lying beyond belief about events that occurred, causing people who weren’t there to blame the NYU administration for hurt and destruction that the protestors actually caused.
you guys should be ashamed of yourselves. i respect your right to protest, but take some responsibility for your actions. I supported you guys until I saw read your after-posts and saw how disingenuous you were.
what unbelievable liars you all are.
liars liars liars.
I appreciate “NYUMom’s” elaboration on her daughter’s situation (and regret her confusion on my obviously sarcastic comment about world peace). I am in a similar situation, having put myself through NYU and currently law school with scholarships and loans. I know how tough it is and I empathize. But I am embarrassed and outraged by these students actions which I believe shame the university and my degree. I also am shocked by the request from NYUMom - “please do not criticize what you do not know” - wasn’t the whole point of this episode to encourage the free expression of ideas and to highlight NYU’s so-called refusal to tolerate dissent? These students occupied a cafeteria to promote those ideas and I can’t freely express my ideas - mostly disgust - on web blog open to all on the internet?
And to Alexander who is so concerned that I am spending too much time on the internet and not enough time studying - fortunately, it is spring break in law school so I have time. And this topic regarding my alma mater and everyone’s comments interest me. Is that an acceptable reason to post my opinions? Gosh for people who want to promote democracy, telling people who disagree with you to basically go away is kind of ironic.
I think y’all had a lot of good points, but your demand list was totally incoherent and seemed designed to alienate people (i.e., the stuff about Gaza). I’m no fan of Israel but I really can’t figure out what the connection is between that and grad student unions or releasing the university’s operating budget. This is meant to be constructive criticism — protest Israel, protest NYU policies, but trying to do both at once is going to weaken you by making you look unorganized and, well, silly.
Solidarity from students at the London School of Economics. We won our occupation, and secured scholarships for Palestinians! Don’t give up until you get what you started for!
Michael
To the protesters and those who sympathize with them,
I am writing this because you truly don’t seem to understand just how ridiculous you look. It is not that your intentions are not laudable; in fact, I think everyone can see that you are well-meaning. The problem is that you are so caught up in your own idealistic world that you ignored the practicalities of advocating for your cause and in the end made it all about you.
Your demands, as others have said, was a schizophrenic jumble of issues. You had no focus. How was anyone supposed to know which of your numerous and wholly unrelated issues really mattered to you? Financial disclosure, financial aid, amnesty, public access to Bobst, Gaza scholarships– no one could tell what you really wanted, and it was very unrealistic to think that you could get all these things which made it hard to take you seriously.
And instead of using your number one demand to indicate which goal mattered most to you, your first demand was a selfish one which cemented the idea that you were not serious about your goals. You weren’t willing to sacrifice for your goals, and it suggested that you were engaging in the protest for fun rather than to really make a statement. The whole point of civil disobedience is that you accept your punishment because you believe in your cause. Additionally, if you are successful at making yourself sympathetic, which you were not, being punished makes those you are fighting against look oppressive and unfair.
The inclusion of Gaza on your list of demands was probably what really made you all look over the top. There is nothing wrong with wanting to advocate for assisting the people in Gaza, but it is a very politicized issue and it has nothing at all to do with your stated purpose of “taking back NYU.” The issue was too big and swallowed up your list of demands. If you want to advocate for Gaza, do so separately. It has nothing to do with financial disclosure and affordable tuition.
And it was clear that your demands were not well thought-out. Simply desiring an outcome is not enough. You have to think about what is actually achievable and what consequences your goals will have in other areas. You also have to do cost-benefit analysis to figure out if your demand is the best way of achieving your goal. What struck me was that you seem to think that unless your specific demands were fulfilled, an injustice would be done as though there were no better way to accomplish your goals. For instance, are scholarships really the best way to help people in Gaza? Maybe the money could be put to better use in another way. And why Gaza? Why not the Sudan, or Iran, or one of the many other places in the world where people could use assistance.
You also seemed to lack regard for other students. You picked a place to occupy that would affect your fellow students most of all. If financial disclosure is what you want, why not chain yourself to a desk at the office of the bursar? And for all your talk of democracy, your demands for public access to Bobst and for financial support to Gaza displayed a shocking lack of consideration for the wishes of your peers. It was clear that you were trying to force your own political agenda on the school, not make the process more democratic (which you could have protested for specifically instead of the politicized demands you made).
In addition to alienating students, you also became a laughingstock in the public eye. Any publicity is not good publicity in this case. If you had avoided the problems I outlined above (and demonstrated a history of unsuccessfully trying to accomplish your goals through less radical means, something I did not see in any news about your protest), you would have looked more sympathetic. This is pretty important. It is not enough to have the support of your activist friends, you need also to engender support in the general public. If you had done this, the school would have had to treat you more seriously. Instead you became a laughingstock whose punishment many people called for, giving the school much leeway to be as rigid as they like. You all can talk self-servingly about what great martyrs you are and how even in the face of public criticism you endured, but you really need to work on gaining sympathy because without public support you will fail. Let this be a lesson of how you come across to those not cut from the same political cloth as you (and even to those who are).
All in all, you ended up making it all about you. I have no doubt that you all believe you are doing right, but you are only think about your own desires and lauding yourselves as heroes when in fact if you really wanted to accomplish your goals, you would have put more thought into it and gave more consideration to the feasibility of your demands. Instead, you are seemingly more caught up in demonstrating for the sake of demonstrating because it makes you feel like an agent of change. Unfortunately for you, this is not the way you change things, and you all don’t seem to understand that.
I agree with some of the people who say go somewhere else. NYU is so great because people say it is. If everyone went somewhere else it would just be the “Real Expensive School in Lower Manhattan”. I agree with most that NYU is real expensive. It was too expensive for me anyway. I went to CUNY where some of the campuses are over 100 years old. I think if there was a mass exodus from these “sought after” and high priced universities, they would get the hint. Supply and demand.
If you think you really have a case in terms of transparency then maybe you should be contacting The Commission on Higher Education of the Middle States Association of Colleges and Schools. A school will move if the accreditation is in danger. The Western States Commission canceled a universities accreditation after a transparency issue. It closed down the next year.
As for the Gaza scholarships, there are probably a good reason for asking for them. As for what they are isn’t really clear. It made the transparency demand look like something someone thought up after a frat party while in conference with Jack Daniels. If all of your demands are really that important then you need to get them out there and keep them out there in the press. Going “Guerrilla” just makes you look like “Gorillas”.
Please PLEASE don’t try something like this again. If you’re going to have a protest or an “occupation”, please don’t take your cues from out-dated 1960s counterculture (communiques?) and try your best to put together a cohesive, relevant list of demands that actually has the support of more than a handful of NYU students.
I understand your frustration with Israel, and I understand why you’d think that innocent civilians need help. But this protest was neither the time nor the place for demands related to that topic. This is supposed to be about university transparency and making NYU a better place for its students. You can’t just tack on your personal causes to an unrelated set of demands - especially when those causes are very controversial and are going to cost you the support you so desperately need to be successful. Not to mention that it is bizarre that you’d be so interested in helping students in Gaza, but not anywhere else in the world. There are LOTS of suffering young people who deserve an education. If you are interested in giving them one, don’t demand it from your university - start an affinity group and raise the cash yourself. You’re not going to get frozen tuition, fare wages for workers AND free scholarships for a very and bizarrely specific set of people.
You should also rethink your unwavering support of the University of Gaza in light of their VERY unsocial justice-y policies. That university has an agenda that involves pushing a fundamentalist Islamic worldview and Sharia law. These things don’t bode well for women, gays or non-Muslims. How can you support ANY religious institution that is so intolerant you claim to be a social justice group? I wonder if you’d take the same sort of leap for Liberty University or BYU - fundamentalism is fundamentalism, my friends.
Finally, you need to step back and question if your tactics helped or hurt your cause. Occupying and shutting down a dining hall did not endear you to your fellow students. The letters of support from the UK, the New School, UCLA, etc. mean nothing because NYU doesn’t care what they think, they care what their students think. At my college, we protested against a VERY discriminatory policy the administration refused to address. What was most instrumental in our success was that we spoke directly to our fellow students, educated them on the facts and - most importantly - got a referendum on the student govt ballot with an administrative agreement that a vote of at least 60% support would result in automatic negotiations. We got a huge turnout and were in negotiations a week later. The university was very concerned that so many students agreed and the policy was changed by the end of the year. I know it’s fun to be radical and take over a building to have a dance party, but it’s not going to work (as you’ve probably learned at this point).
I saw you guys in front of kimmel during the day, and it just looked like a bunch of kids wanting to have fun together. If you want to protest and demand something from the administration, maybe you should find better means of doing so than taking a shirt and bra off and smoking while laughing.
Let’s all give (and catch) a glimpse of the shape of things to come…
Much respect and solidarity from Greece
[...] Official Statement from Take Back NYU! Feb 21st, 2009 by Take Back NYU! [...]
i bet you are all wondering why your blog has been targeted so viciously by people claiming to be new-yorkers or ‘fellow students’…it’s simple : you were acting in solidarity with gaza, and every pro-zionist troll in the world was alerted to this fact via this website and it’s nifty downloadable ‘insta-zionist troll’ application…
http://giyus.org/
they can mega-phone you all they want, but know that there are MANY people around the world who appreciate what you guys did and stand in solidarity with you.
Ah Jane, indeed you do confuse me.
” I also am shocked by the request from NYUMom - “please do not criticize what you do not know” - wasn’t the whole point of this episode to encourage the free expression of ideas and to highlight NYU’s so-called refusal to tolerate dissent? These students occupied a cafeteria to promote those ideas and I can’t freely express my ideas - mostly disgust - on web blog open to all on the internet? ”
I am missing the link between “please do not criticize what you do not know” and the whole free expression of ideas thing. Of course, that may just be one of the things that you “regret that I do not recognize as sarcasm” again. I absolutely support your free expression of ideas. But your post was not an expression of any idea that I could see - it was a blanket condemnation - please re-read: “This is the most self-indulgent bs I have ever heard. You guys are beyond a joke and should all be expelled. You have a great opportunity, lots of people would do anything for an NYU education, yet you choose to use your time at NYU advocating the worthwhile cause of……hating NYU?!?! Brilliant. World peace is so last year.” My post merely pointed out that your characterization of all the protesters as being self-ndulgent, being “beyond a joke”, your inference that everyone involved had somehow NOT done anything for their NYU education, and that the protesters hated NYU - was not true of my daughter and indeed not true of any of the protesters who I have knowledge of. Ideas are absolutely what this is all about but perhaps you can point out to me where in your post an idea is presented. What your post DID express was your opinion. I was merely pointing out that the opinion you expressed was not based upon facts and before you deliver a blanket condemnation like that you really ought to bother knowing the facts.
I don’t believe such liberal activism does a thing. Nothing short of systemic, structural change, the kind made possible only through a socialist revolution, will bring anything like permanence to the issues you address. Surely NYU, a private, bourgeois institution, cannot and will not be an important agent in any political solution in the Middle East or elsewhere. Liberal, “left,” and “progressive” activism on piecemeal, fragmentary, isolated and causes du jour will never amount to any kind of systemic change. This is the crisis of capitalism and the petty bourgeois “left” responses to it based on identity politics and other grocery list fragmentary approaches. The question is whether these students have too much of a stake in the system as prospective bourgeois subjects to do anything like support a real revolutionary political movement. I doubt it. I see these students as similar to the petty bourgeois activists of the 60s, who now are today’s politically useless aging hippy-yuppies.
“Taking back” NYU makes as much sense as “taking back” The Gap or a supermarket.
Getting national or international press an accomplishment? I don’t see how you can feel you accomplished anything from worldwide headlines of “Hey, look at these idiots!”
You are all a bunch of press hungry anarchist. Just go check out some of the TAKE BACK NYU members facebook pages. There are many common things.
1) No finance or science majors
2) Unattractive
3) Something along the lines of “fuck the man” “anarchy for life”
4) Disillusion with reality
Referring to the post above calling these people LIARS. How right you are.. Not only are they liars by calling this a PEACEFUL process, despite trying to knock down a police barrier AND the police to get into a building, which is WHY the police used their batons (to protect themselves from being trampled), BUT by systematically removing all of the negative comments posted on here.. I have been reading these posts every day and the VAST majority have been negative… Even the “positive” ones are tepid (ie, while I applaud your causes, your actions were criminal and juvenile, etc).. So, Banu, or whomever is the moderator of the site has been removing most of the negative posts and only leaving a FEW negative ones so its not TOO blatant…. I’m sure this post won’t make it very far either…. Sorry Banu… I think 99.8% of NYU students think you are your group are a bunch of idiots and are glad to see you go,, Try New School.. Their gang of masked students who tried to “help” you guys the other night might treat you like heroes”.. The only mildly positive comments you are getting are from people who were NOT at the protests to see you guys on the ground AND on the balcony screaming to “fuck the police” and storm the building.. REALLY PEACEFUL.. I think I remember seeing videos of Ghandi doing this too….. You are already criminals and Former NYU students now,, why not redeem yourself and at LEAST be truthful???
“The willingness to express and act on dissent should not result in the disruption of students’ education or housing.”
To the members of TBNYU:
Statements like the one quoted here sadly undermine your otherwise very noble cause. NYU was the original “dissenter” (i.e. “dissenting” from responsible activity, which is implied in the motives for your actions in the first place). That “resulted in” a rather obvious “disruption of students’ education” (no matter how you spin it, locking yourselves in Kimmel disrupted students’ education, if only indirectly and temporarily). In other words, TBNYU responded to NYU’s expression of dissent by being disruptive, and is now concerned that the administration is responding with similar actions.
Please, stop shooting yourselves in the foot. You’ve got a good thing going here. Don’t give the nay-sayers legitimate reason to dismiss you by not thinking more carefully about what it is you want and how to go about getting it.
Hello, cheers for the protesters! Probably things like these make US ‘great’.
I am a student in a prestigious college in India and this place is a wasteland. The administration does whatever it wants without consulting the students or even offering any justification. On the internet(which is a very immoral-thing) they have blocked sites like sourceforge.net and orkut.com. Rules change daily and they needn’t be documented too.
The incredible thing is that nobody protests! Mostly people are apathetic to any issue not related to TV Series and those who do care are scared stiff that if they protest they will be jobless after college. All this in a top ranking college in India.
That 18 students stuck up till the end is incredible. I couldn’t find 1 person to join a protest I was planning some time back! (Although I got lot of “encouragement”.)
In response to #39:
Right, because we are critical of an ineffective “occupation” that managed to undermine the importance of some admittedly interesting issues, we must be agents of global Zionism.
Clearly, the nefarious Israelis must have had a hand in ending the occupation (you gotta admit that would be ironic, right?). I support the idea of starting cultural exchanges with Palestinians (as well as other people living under someone else’s boot) but the idea that the negative comments on this blog are coordinated is crossing the line into straight-up Antisemitism. You failed to attract popular support. That’s your fault, not anyone else.
Appeals to the administration for kindness to the students may accomplish something in the short term to remediate the damages that the student action has done to the students themselves. But unless the students understand that they are and have acted under a false premise, a mistaken understanding of social relations, then they and others like them will commit themselves to similarly futile, defeatist enterprises in the future. This is the agglomeration of piece-meal, fragmentary, identity politics leftism in the US, which operates as if isolated elements in the system can be addressed one at a time, independent of the whole, and treated like a cancer. Such an approach seeks to isolate and treat each reified instance as utterly disconnected from the whole. If only Israel wouldn’t bomb the Gaza, if only NYU would give scholarships to Gaza students, if only, if only, if only…
But NONE of these issues can be approached as single-issue items, or as an amalgam of cobbled together items, treated outside of the socio-economic and historical context and the whole organization of society under capitalism. And to treat them as such is to run the risks that these students have run: they have endangered their academic careers for a futile effort, because they operate from a false premise–that some sort of “action,” some mayhem, some “activist” trouble-making will effect change, when the total system is going to adjust to such disequilibrium in an instant, and restore order immediately. All that has happened is that the students have endangered their futures and made their own possible maneuverings in the world more difficult. And they have gained nothing from this sacrifice. Because liberal activism is flawed in its orientation due to a failure to understand the nature of the enemy, or the task at hand. I am not arguing for the status quo. I am arguing for an intelligent, programmatic and effective approach to changing it. And this sort of activity is not at all recommended.
The fact is, such liberal, progressive, radical “left” politics is doomed. It has no idea that you cannot lobby a corporation to be a nicer corporation because there are other compensations that will take place. Israel is the imperialist outpost of US capitalism, and it will not go away as such without ending capitalism. Period.
Similarly, private institutions will charge money, exploit their workers, alienate students, and tend toward higher prices, as long as private institutions exist. PERIOD.
The answer is to work with program, a party of the workers, to end the system that produces this entire reality.
Go to the middle east, Occupy a building in Gaza, be prepared to die for what you believe in, be prepared to starve for what you believe in, and I swear on my mother I will have undying respect for you. If your not prepared to make that sacrifice(its perfectly understandable if your not, few would be), don’t waste peoples time. Instead help people where you are, there are people who need it. The world is not yet globalized enough for you to stage a successful protest 10000 miles away from the problem.
don’t believe me? the proof is in the pudding? Did your protest work, did it change many peoples minds? The only people on this thread supporting it are an out of touch student from Britain (WTFUCK does he know about the U.S from his fairytale kingdom where guns are unheard of health care is ubiquitous and Oxford is free to attend?) and a sweet mother of a student protester. The rest of the commentators hate your methods and by inciting such hatred you have weakened your cause. Their is no hope for you methods in sight. Ber realistic, what are you gonna do? Take over another building next time with the same result. I’m telling you, go to Gaza, sure its dangerous but the only time NVprotest has worked was when people put themselves in serious serious danger. You know i’m right your delusional if you think you will make progress the king of the optimists would not tell you to keep up the good work, he’d say “What good work? you guys are on the wrong track and your alienating people and pissing them off.” You have to be honest with yourselves about how the world is, how people are and how the press is. Your only chance at getting sympathy is , going to Gaza to show the world that you are really committed, and putting yourself in danger so that people see how the problems hit home for these people (when they see someone from their home being treated like an animal. Whats that you say? You go to a really nice school, are privileged and don’t want to give that up by really putting your ass out there? Good point thought you would say that. That would be my decision too. But now that you’ve acknowledged this fact why don’t you try to do some good work helping people in need in your own country and making a real difference (just like you would be doing in Gaza except in America hey, your not in as much danger!) by doing some community service in some really poverty stricken oppressed areas of the very city in which you attend school. That way you won’t be misplacing your energy and inconveniencing hungry students who have paid or worked for the privilege of eating in a nice dining hall whenver they please.
BTW, if you want to effect a private institutions policies, you don’t protest, you boycott! What your doing is like feeding yourself with one hand and slapping your mouth with the other, its counter intuitive and defies logic.
Wanna hear a joke?
TBNYU.
Ignore all these naysayers and idiots who do nothing besides sit on their ass and bitch about people who actually can get something done.
I live way in California and students here are talking about your occupation. What you students did at NYU was a tremendous step forward in the fight against student apathy. Thank you so much for the spark.
p.s. where is the petition for those of us who didn’t agree with the sit-in?
So ends the most comical protest I have ever seen. Your goals and your tactics were ridiculous. Your moral authority is the equivalent of country club members protesting their dues.
You attend[ed?] NYU as part of a private arrangement. By attending, you agreed to abide by NYU’s policies and procedures. This is not like protesting the actions of a democratically elected government. In a democratically elected government derives its powers from the governed, so protest by the governed is a valid means of expression. This, in contrast, is breaching a contract because you don’t like the terms. Social justice and notions of fairness don’t even enter into the equation. You entered a voluntary arrangement that defines your rights.
A final word of advice: next time protest to bring publicity to broader issue, rather than your narrow personal goals. People will be a lot more supportive and you won’t look like idiots.
As the saying goes, the customer is always right. Students at NYU are paying a sky high “ivy league” price to attend a school that treats them like second class citizens, and they have good reasons to be angry. Being a NYU graduate, I do support these students for being bold and addressing a problem that has been festering for years. The school takes a large chunk of your money and does not give you anything substantial in return. Then you wonder where all the money went. The education is mediocre at best and the school’s infrastructure is borderline shoddy. The entire NYU campus is a outdated and crusty, with all the money the school receives from tuition revenues and generous contributions, you would expect the school to fix its sidewalks and patch up its bad areas. If you don’t know what I’m talking about, just pay a visit to the Bobst library. It is completetly outdated for our times with its old half broken desks and chairs, smelly bathrooms without adequate ventiliation, and rooms and doors that remind us of the 1970s or earlier. This should be a complete embarassment for the school that is considered “world renowned”. The adminstration is mostly run by a bunch of condescending and arrogant assholes who are apathetic to everyone except themselves.
These students have completely convinced me that I should not give money to the school anymore. I also will not take anymore postgraduate classes after hearing a department director tell me that I’m too good for the school, which is a response typical of some of these condescending pricks that govern the school.
If you are an intelligent member of the NYU community, you should realize there is something inherently wrong with school’s misappropriation of its money after all these years of refusal to fully upgrade its infrastructure.
Shame on you NYU!